I tried swimming through the NIST report on how the towers fell but not until this morning did I get a decent, easy to understand explanation. This came courtesy of Discovery Channel’s Frontiers of Construction, one of my favourite shows.
It helps dispel the theory that bombs or internal explosions brought the tower down and runs through the key reasons why the towers fell.
Of particular note is the comment that once the towers hit, it was inevitable that they were going to fall due to the fireproofing being scoured off the supports. Had the fireproofing been intact and the fire continued to rage, there was a very high likelihood the towers would have remained standing.
This was an incredible revelation.
I recorded and uploaded to YouTube for the world to see two things.
1) how the towers fell and
2) what a great show Frontiers of Construction is.
If you can’t see the above video, then you can visit the YouTube link here.
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Phenominal show. One of my favorites.
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No matter what evidence is presented, there are those who will argue. Some nutbars seriously believe the planes were shot down by Air Force fighter jets and explosive laden substitutes were flown as drones into the towers… all ordered by the evil Bush hisself… 🙁
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fascinating !! … now thats clear then , isnt it ?
oh yes, but what about building 7 ?… similar building, no plane … hmmmm
and the fire in madrid ?.. 24 hour inferno and that one didnt fall ..maybe the US should get the Spanish to build the new world trade center..because the Spaniards are renowned for great building skills ..arent they ?
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL4isaZRapY&mode=related&search=
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The thing about conspiracy theories that loses me is how they always assign evil motives to the government.
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AB Tech I hear ya. I have only heard conspiracies implicating Bush and his administration. No one seems to be going after everyone who shorted airline stocks the day before the attack or the execs of opposing airlines not used, etc.
I wonder if I am just being a skeptic or if they are the skeptics…and then I remember that California space cult and I feel good again knowing I am on the side of common sense and not common stupidity.
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Until we have an identical building hit in the exact way there is no point to believe the conspiracy
people’s claims that are based on smaller towers built with non-WTC methods, the steel beams didn’t have to “melt” to cause collapsing because the sheer weight off the upper floor only had to shift the center-point of load away from the I-beam and from there gravity takes over .
The floor below the impact wasn’t designed for a compounded load of a downward kenitic energy , just take the average straw from McDonald’s and compare how you can easily Bend it until it kinks , but look how easily you could ram the straw into a potato surface
and create a spud dowel .
I’m still waiting to hear about where all those passengers went since “Drones” with missiles replace
3 of the four jet liners, or are they too at Area 51
with the Roswell aliens ,Elvis,Bigfoot,JFK’s real body,backward engineered stealth UFO’s and whatever else can avoid the Conspiracy people from producing
solid evidence to their claims.
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Trust, you can sum up the feeling I get when I hear conspiracy theories as being alot like the self-shame you feel when you watch a particularly bad part of a lame and pathetic sitcom.
Roger, watching the Discovery channel documentary is basically getting the info straight from the horses mouth. They interview the architect who designed it and the engineering firm who were contracted to investigate the incident.
Basically what the engineers said was that the force of the impact shook the fire-retardant insulation from the beams. Then the tons and tons of jetfuel provided enough heat to weaken the beams on that floor causing it to collapse. The “pancaking” of the floor was too much to bear and the building collapsed.
The towers were designed to take a jet impact, maybee wo, but there was no design done to account for the nearly full tanks of fuel.
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AB Tech, you hit the nail on the head with your last sentence. That link Ian puts up to the comments by DeMartini is so flawed in that he says a) he believes. and b) multiple impacts.
Impacts implies the physical blow of an airplane. If the pencil he alludes to were loaded with jet fuel and fire applied to it, that mosquito net analogy would just burn up like a piece of paper.
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The reality is guys… we will NEVER KNOW THE TRUTH .. the only evidence which can prove exactly what happened, and why.. is held by the FBI and they wont release it..
I am sure that they have the ‘ best interests’ of all of us as heart.. maybe they dont want to upset us ?..
..maybe they are concerned that if we knew the truth we would all support an invasion in the middle east ( even if they didnt have all the oil) and want Mr Bush to dominate the entire world.. he wouldnt want that anyway would he ?..
So, why not prove us all wrong ?…
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ps the drones.. if they were used, would have been boarded by FBI/CIA agents and they probably would have not done the kamikazze thing ..possibly they got off when the plane was ‘swapped’ .. it didnt need to be tho !!
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Ian, do you use Alcan brand tinfoil for that hat? Cause I know a guy who knew a guy who overheard someone talking about how the Aliens own Alcan and they’re spreading the mind controll rumors to boost sales.
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AT – hahahahahahahahaha I needed that after a long day.
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Couldn’t help myself. >:)
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Dear readers, especially Albertan Technophile I can see you are an educated , and thinking person (ps the word control has only one letter ‘l’ in it )
Please believe what you like.. Im sure you will and the German people who supported the Nazis felt the same..
TrustOnlyMulder has had another hard day at the gas chamber… still, its aliving, someone has to do it and he was only following orders anyway.
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Oh my god, thats about the most senseless thing I’ve ever read! The only point you made is that I can’t spell, and beside the fact that its a bit childish to point it out, the fact remains that I consider blog comments to be informal and really couldn’t care about my spelling.
and by the way, I’d apologise to TOM for that insult if you’ve any honor at all. He doesn’t deserve that happy horseshit.
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Nice to see Godwin’s Law still works.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichstag_fire
suit yourself !! see it read it and compare.. I was not being particularly disrespectful to anyone but if you think this a laugh after a hard day at work then u deserve the grief.. Its not funny ! theres no tin foil hat involved , triangulation of data is a well established scientific methodology of scrutinising data. I suggest if you knownothing of it then you either watch the video objectively .. or shut the fuck up.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichstag_fire
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Exhibit “A”
Ian said “I was not being particularly disrespectful to anyone but…”
Exhibit “B”
Ian said “Please believe what you like.. Im sure you will and the German people who supported the Nazis felt the same..
TrustOnlyMulder has had another hard day at the gas chamber… still, its aliving, someone has to do it and he was only following orders anyway.
————————————————
Prima facie case of Godwin’s Law. Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I rest my case.
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“There is a tradition in many newsgroups and other Internet discussion forums that once such a comparison is made, the thread is finished and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically “lost” whatever debate was in progress. This principle is itself frequently (though perhaps incorrectly) referred to as Godwin’s Law.”
I looked it up for yah Ian, since you’re too busy being an ass to figure out what Mac was trying to say.
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On the September 2002 television documentary American Rebuilds. Mr. Silverstein said:
I remember getting a call from the Fire Department commander, telling me they were not sure they were going to be able to contain the fire. I said, you know, “We’ve had such terrible loss of life that the smartest thing to do is just pull it.” And they made that decision to pull it and we watched the [World Trade Center 7] building collapse.
However, the same PBS video in which Silverstein makes his admission, contains the following exchange:
(unidentified construction worker): “Hello? Oh, we’re getting ready to pull building six.” Luis Mendes, NYC Dept of Design and Construction: “We had to be very careful how we demolished building six. We were worried about the building six coming down and then damaging the slurry walls, so we wanted that particular building to fall within a certain area.”
On September 9, 2005 (three years later), Mr. Dara McQuillan, a “spokesman” for Silverstein Properties, issued the following statement on this issue:
In the afternoon of September 11, Mr. Silverstein spoke to the Fire Department Commander on site at Seven World Trade Center. The Commander told Mr. Silverstein that there were several firefighters in the building working to contain the fires. Mr. Silverstein expressed his view that the most important thing was to protect the safety of those firefighters, including, if necessary, to have them withdraw from the building.
Later in the day, the Fire Commander ordered his firefighters out of the building and at 5:20 p.m. the building collapsed. No lives were lost at Seven World Trade Center on September 11, 2001.
Too bad he didn’t read Popular Mechanics…
Dr. Shyam Sunder, of the National Institutes of Standards and Technology (NIST), which investigated the collapse of WTC 7, is quoted in Popular Mechanics (9/11: Debunking the Myths, March, 2005) as saying: “There was no firefighting in WTC 7.”
Or this article by James Glanz in the New York Times on November 29, 2001 about WTC 7:
“By 11:30 a.m., the fire commander in charge of that area, Assistant Chief Frank Fellini, ordered firefighters away from it for safety reasons.”
Or maybe even the FEMA report
The FEMA report on the collapses, from May, 2002, also says about the WTC 7 collapse: “no manual firefighting operations were taken by FDNY.”
I know we conspiracy theorists should just ignore this confession of Larry Silverstein like NIST and FEMA. Larry made billions off the insurance companies after taking control of all seven buildings in July 2001 and heavily insuring WTC 1 and 2 against terrorist attacks. Three buildings fell on 9-11. Seven buildings were destroyed as a result of 9-11, all Larry’s.
Should I continue on the never retracted admission of George Bush in December 2004 of seeing the first plane hit WTC #1 LIVE?
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On the September 2002 television documentary American Rebuilds. Mr. Silverstein said:
I remember getting a call from the Fire Department commander, telling me they were not sure they were going to be able to contain the fire. I said, you know, “We’ve had such terrible loss of life that the smartest thing to do is just pull it.” And they made that decision to pull it and we watched the [World Trade Center 7] building collapse.
However, the same PBS video in which Silverstein makes his admission, contains the following exchange:
(unidentified construction worker): “Hello? Oh, we’re getting ready to pull building six.” Luis Mendes, NYC Dept of Design and Construction: “We had to be very careful how we demolished building six. We were worried about the building six coming down and then damaging the slurry walls, so we wanted that particular building to fall within a certain area.”
On September 9, 2005 (three years later), Mr. Dara McQuillan, a “spokesman” for Silverstein Properties, issued the following statement on this issue:
In the afternoon of September 11, Mr. Silverstein spoke to the Fire Department Commander on site at Seven World Trade Center. The Commander told Mr. Silverstein that there were several firefighters in the building working to contain the fires. Mr. Silverstein expressed his view that the most important thing was to protect the safety of those firefighters, including, if necessary, to have them withdraw from the building.
Later in the day, the Fire Commander ordered his firefighters out of the building and at 5:20 p.m. the building collapsed. No lives were lost at Seven World Trade Center on September 11, 2001.
Too bad he didn’t read Popular Mechanics…
Dr. Shyam Sunder, of the National Institutes of Standards and Technology (NIST), which investigated the collapse of WTC 7, is quoted in Popular Mechanics (9/11: Debunking the Myths, March, 2005) as saying: “There was no firefighting in WTC 7.”
Or this article by James Glanz in the New York Times on November 29, 2001 about WTC 7:
“By 11:30 a.m., the fire commander in charge of that area, Assistant Chief Frank Fellini, ordered firefighters away from it for safety reasons.”
Or maybe even the FEMA report
The FEMA report on the collapses, from May, 2002, also says about the WTC 7 collapse: “no manual firefighting operations were taken by FDNY.”
I know we conspiracy theorists should just ignore this confession of Larry Silverstein like NIST and FEMA. Larry made billions off the insurance companies after taking control of all seven buildings in July 2001 and heavily insuring WTC 1 and 2 against terrorist attacks. Three buildings fell on 9-11. Seven buildings were destroyed as a result of 9-11, all Larry’s.
Should I continue on the never retracted admission of George Bush in December 2004 of seeing the first plane hit WTC #1 LIVE?
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Sorry for the duplicate post.
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did you guys see fahrenheit 9 11 a few days ago?
it was broadcast on Uk mainstream TV and followed by ‘ the falling man ‘ last night … was it shown there ?
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mmm i do have to say you put up a good fight. I just have more faith in our society and what is right about it than you do and the faith you have that our society is a mess.
Do you not realize how many people would need to be involved in a conspiracy theory? How many levels of government? How many people with hearts that black all keeping their mouths shut?
instead we have people with dark minds.
Ian, I wouldn’t watch a piece of propaganda crap Michael Moore puts out if you paid me. I lost all respect for him long ago and he admits that he is a propagandist who manipulates footage for his personal benefit and persuasions.
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I watched F9-11 long after it passed through the theatres. People who hate George W Bush love this mockumentary as it suits them fine. People who love truth hate this mockumentary as Moore filmed a conspiracy theory based on folly.
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Of course he’s a propagandist, and Bush, Blair, and The Talliban are all neutral observers.. The Popes doing well in the popularity stakes too I see !..
We’re all doomed !… any cheap flight tickets to somewhere nice , inexpensive and warm on Ebay .. ?
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To Trustonlymulder, at least four: Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolferwitz, Pearl, and maybe Bush I (I wouldn’t doubt Clinton may also have some knowledge). I don’t see why you would think thousands would be involved in the conspiracy. All you need is to run terrorist simulations at the exact same time the real “terrorists” were doing their work and thereby confuse everyone (false radar blips, phantom jets shadowing real jets, send military fighters the wrong way, etc.). They had several simulations prior to 9-11 to cover all the bases. You would only need a handful of highly skilled and highly rewarded people to have knowledge that WTC 1, 2, and 7 were going to come down. Google and download, who killed John O’Neill? It’s a good watch.
Look at who has and continues to profit from 9-11. Bush II was aware of what was happening, not to mention his secret service men. Why else would he be allowed to sit for 7 minutes reading a goat story while at the same time, Dick Cheney (who’s only job is to cast the tie breaking vote in the Senate) was manhandled by four secret service agents into a secret bunker under the white house. Bush was then sent on a flight around the country because Cheney told him not to return to Washington. No one was reprimanded or fired because of 9-11. But quite a few first responders have paid, or are now paying dearly due to the air quality at ground zero. Those that question the government are told or threatened with siding with the terrorists.
My main argument is WTC 7 came down, the owner admitted to it, he took out heavy “terrorist insurance” prior to 9-11 and he collected double because he argued two attacks against WTC 1 and 2. FEMA couldn’t explain the collapse and NIST used hand drawn markups of pictures to try and explain why it collapsed. It was very amateurish at best, not something that would stand the scrutiny of a panel of professional engineers which NIST continuously refuses to go up against.
Keep the faith. I wish I could be on your side. But the facts speak for themselves.